Onagadori - Long Tail Fowl and Long Crowing Fowl Discussion Forums

Onagadori - Long Tail Fowl and Long Crowing Fowl Discussion Forums

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 Post subject: My Satsumadori's and my friends Shokoku
PostPosted: Thu Aug 20, 2009 1:27 pm 
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My Satsumadori's
Red
Image

Image


Image


Image


Grey Hen
Image


Image

Black

Image






My Friends Shokoku
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Image


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Aug 20, 2009 4:50 pm 
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Location: Claremont, North Carolina
Very nice birds! Like the red one.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 20, 2009 7:33 pm 
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Location: northern Indiana, USA
Welcome to the forum! I look forward to seeing more posts from you. You and your friend have birds there that most breeders can only dream about.

All of the birds you showed look well muscled, very refined, and have excellent type. Quite good examples of the breeds. Especially the red Satsumadori roosters! Thank you so much for sharing your photos. :)


David

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 Post subject: hey
PostPosted: Thu Aug 20, 2009 11:05 pm 
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Joined: Thu Nov 15, 2007 12:23 am
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Location: Georgia,USA
Those are some incredable birds yall have. Keep up the good work.

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Aldridge gamefowl and longtails http://s236.photobucket.com/albums/ff26 ... rooster19/


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 21, 2009 3:32 am 
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IndianaGardener wrote:
Welcome to the forum! I look forward to seeing more posts from you. You and your friend have birds there that most breeders can only dream about.

All of the birds you showed look well muscled, very refined, and have excellent type. Quite good examples of the breeds. Especially the red Satsumadori roosters! Thank you so much for sharing your photos. :)


David


Thanks for the warm welcome David :D


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 Post subject: Re: hey
PostPosted: Fri Aug 21, 2009 3:33 am 
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Michealaldridge wrote:
Those are some incredable birds yall have. Keep up the good work.


Hi Micheal, Thanks!!! :)


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 Post subject: Welcome...
PostPosted: Fri Aug 21, 2009 7:56 am 
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Location: Ontario, Canada
Welcome Bud...u finally did it...I just knew our friends here would appreciate your treasured pets...I was inquiring with TMA on the relationship of the Satsumadoris with the Chinese Games that she has...the only main difference that I see is the tail...most other features seem similar... :D


Last edited by Jurrasicbird on Fri Aug 21, 2009 8:29 am, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Aug 21, 2009 8:11 am 
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Location: northern Indiana, USA
Her China Games are built somewhat streamlined in type. The Satsumadori has a more upright posture with very prominent shoulders and thighs.

Prior to obtaining game fowl from, it's said, Thailand (Siam), the Japanese had game fowl from China. They then interbred the Siamese fowl, "Syamo"... "Shamo", with their own. That would account for the long-tail traits from the Chinese fowl and the more rugged build from the Thai origin fowl.


David

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Last edited by IndianaGardener on Fri Aug 21, 2009 8:23 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Aug 21, 2009 8:22 am 
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Location: Ontario, Canada
Oh yes, much like the relative "roundedness" of the Ohiki's compared to the Bantam Phoenix... 8)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Aug 21, 2009 8:30 am 
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The Ohiki and bantam Phoenix thing earlier was like saying a Mini Cooper is the same thing as a stretch limousine. LOL

The Ohiki was developed in the Tosa Prefecture (Kochi) along side the Onagadori or shortly after I believe. It's not known for certain what else went into the breed. The Japanese thought for a long time it was Chabo x Minohiki. However, it does not carry the Chabo's lethal short leg gene. Westerners believe bantam Cochin could be in the mix, but no one really knows for sure. A microsatellite study showed it to be close to neither the Chabo or Minohiki, but shares close relation to the Onagadori. The Ohiki, Onagadori, and Totenko appear to share close genetic relationship based on that study.

Bantam Phoenix are way far away removed from that pool; another continent, another time, and a whole different design.

If you compare a Satsumadori, a Shamo, and a Thai, you'll notice that the Satsumadori resembles the Thai, or Shamo of old, more than the Shamo as we know it today. It's believed by some that Thai are basically what the Shamo was before the Japanese refined it to their liking. So the Satsumadori probably was made using that old Thai type fowl.


David

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Last edited by IndianaGardener on Fri Aug 21, 2009 8:42 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Aug 21, 2009 8:39 am 
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Location: Ontario, Canada
IndianaGardener wrote:

Prior to obtaining game fowl from, it's said, Thailand (Siam), the Japanese had game fowl from China. They then interbred the Siamese fowl, "Syamo"... "Shamo", with their own. That would account for the long-tail traits from the Chinese fowl and the more rugged build from the Thai origin fowl.


David
Is this basically the makeup of the Satsumadoris...


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Aug 21, 2009 8:43 am 
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Very likely. Plus eons of time for refinement of course.


David

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 Post subject: Re: Welcome...
PostPosted: Sat Aug 22, 2009 1:48 am 
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Jurrasicbird wrote:
Welcome Bud...u finally did it...I just knew our friends here would appreciate your treasured pets...I was inquiring with TMA on the relationship of the Satsumadoris with the Chinese Games that she has...the only main difference that I see is the tail...most other features seem similar... :D


Hello My Friend, Thanks for sending me the link to this site.... :D :D :D

My Japanese friend who gave me the satsumadori's .........said they have in their blood Shamo and some Japanese long tail fowl........
Many years ago bred for fighting........


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Aug 22, 2009 6:39 am 
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That supports my theory more or less. In a microsatellite study the Minohiki and Satsumadori were grouped together. Both are believed to contain game, Shamo, that are believed to originate from Thailand.

Second, it's believed that the Japanese got their start of long-tailed genetics by bringing back Chinese temple fighters during the 7th through 9th centuries while Japanese scholars were making trips to and from China to study the culture. So it all fits together.


David

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Aug 24, 2009 6:46 pm 
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Location: southwest central Illinois
Awesome birds, something to be proud of, would like to see more of them.
Dan


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